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2020.08.29 18:23 IdolA29Augl Mat-ure G-ay for Da-ting Hel-p
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2020.08.26 22:01 autotldr Germany appeals for calm as Turkish, Greek navies run drills in EastMed
ISTANBUL - A number of naval drills are underway in the eastern Mediterranean as Turkish and Greek leaders vowed to defend their overlapping territorial claims in the region Wednesday.
Simultaneous naval drills were conducted by Turkey, Greece and Cyprus in the eastern Mediterranean Tuesday, with some exercises continuing Wednesday, amid concerns of a possible conflict in the region.
Though Turkey issued a Navtex Sunday extending the time frame for the Oruc Reis' exploration activities to Aug. 27, Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusolgu said Ankara was ready for talks with Greece following his meeting with Maas."We are open to talks without preconditions," Cavusoglu said in a press conference with Maas in Ankara.
In an effort to calm regional tensions, France joined military exercises called "Eunomia" with Cyprus, Greece and Italy that are scheduled to run Aug. 26-28.
The Greek and US navies held joint drills south of Crete Monday, near the area where the Oruc Reis is operating with an escort of Turkish ships.
Ilke Toygur, an analyst of European affairs at the Elcano Royal Institute and adjunct professor of political science at the Carlos III University of Madrid, said European Mediterranean countries "Were trying to match Turkish drilling activities and demonstrate solidarity with Greece and Republic of Cyprus," but noted, "Both sides are keeping their military interventions [within] limits so that it will be possible to go to the negotiation table before the point of no return."
2020.08.23 15:57 Anarcho_Humanist Collection of Wikipedia articles on US Foreign Policy in Asia
2020.08.15 21:02 autotldr Erdogan says Turkey 'will not back down' in east Med standoff
ISTANBUL - President Tayyip Erdogan said on Saturday Turkey will not back down to threats of sanctions nor to incursions on its claimed territory in the Mediterranean Sea, where it is in a standoff with EU-member Greece over oil and gas exploration rights.
Tensions between NATO members Greece and Turkey have risen in the past week after Turkey sent the Oruc Reis survey vessel, escorted by warships, to map out possible oil and gas drilling in territory over which both countries claim jurisdiction.
The Oruc Reis, which is between Cyprus and the Greek island of Crete, will continue work until Aug. 23, he added.
EU foreign ministers met via video conference on Friday and said Turkey's naval movements would lead to a "Heightened risk of dangerous incidents".
They said a deterioration in the relationship with Turkey was having far-reaching strategic consequences for the entire European Union, well beyond the eastern Mediterranean.
Relations between Greece and Turkey have long been fraught with tension.
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2020.06.10 16:58 NomdeCher What was Ghislaine doing between 1985 and her father’s death in 1991? *Long Post*
I’m interested in three mysteries:submitted by NomdeCher to Epstein [link] [comments]
The Official NarrativeGhislaine was a student at Balliol college Oxford, graduating (bottom of her year, with a third class degree) in 1985. (1) While at university, age 21, her father made her director of Oxford United Football Club. (2) Her father set her up with a corporate gifts business of some description, although details about this are minimal and it isn’t clear where the business operated (London, New York, both, more?). (3)
Getty Images - Mirrorpix
Details are sketchy on the period from her graduation until 1990, when Robert Maxwell launched the European and gave her a role there. A biography gives her title as “Business Development Manager”. (4) After Maxwell’s death, the editor discovered in the records that Ghislaine had been employed as the “Fashion Director” with a salary thought to be £100,000. Eyebrows were raised at this since “[n]obody at the European's Christmas party-cum-wake on Friday night could remember seeing Ms Maxwell in the office more than once some time in the summer of 1990.” (5) The Evening Standard downgrades her role to “fashion consultant” at the European as well as mentioning the gifts company. (6)
In 1991, a few months before his death, Robert Maxwell bought the New York Daily News and he sent Ghislaine to work there as “special projects" director. (7)
Ghislaine rushes to the Maxwell yacht after her father dies. After that, she is widely reported to have “moved” to New York, quickly meeting and falling in with Jeffrey Epstein:
“However Ghislaine Maxwell, 33, Cicogna's ex-love of four years, came from New York where she has lived since the death on Guy Fawkes Day 1991 of her panda-proportioned-publisher father Robert - she was escorted by the Queen's godson, Charles Butter, 35.”
The IndiscrepanciesGhislaine obviously lived a jet-set life, travelled widely, and seems to have had social and business obligations in both London and New York throughout this time. For example, she attended a charity kissathon event given by photographer Koo Stark—Prince Andrew’s former girlfriend, and winner of a six figure libel suit against Robert Maxwell after his paper claimed their relationship had been adulterous—in Mayfair (London) in 1988. (8) She was launched in New York society at a party given by her father on his infamous yacht in 1989; Donald Trump was one of the many notable guests. (9)
The Lady Ghislaine (purchased from the Kashoggi family who also owned the yacht that became the \"Trump Princess\"; journalist Jamal Kashoggi was murdered in the Saudi Embassy in Istanbul in 2018)
Her father had increasingly large business holdings in America towards the end of his life (which was useful since it allowed his sons to file for bankruptcy in the US under more lenient laws than in the UK) that she played some role in. Why is she always described as having “begun” to live in America in 1991 when the record makes it seem likely that she in fact just continued to live there? She was certainly working and living in New York from the early 90’s, but she had spent time and made contacts in the city through her father in the 80’s. The nature of the corporate gifts business is not clear, but it may also have operated in New York.
The question of where she was spending her time is important because the other widely repeated chapter of the story is that Ghislaine met Epstein some time in 1991, after the death of her father. This could be true. However, there are hints that there might be more to the story. The Sydney Morning Herald—I believe this was syndicated in/from the Telegraph (London), but it’s behind a paywall—open a story on Ghislaine with a strange formulation:
There is an apocryphal, but tantalising, story that has long been doing the rounds of New York society about how Jeffrey Epstein first entered the life of Ghislaine Maxwell – or should that be vice versa?This is a weird story! It’s beyond belief. Of course it is flagged as gossip, but why then print it? What should we infer from it, if anything?
There are more stories that muddy the water. In a deposition, accountant Maritza Vasquez claims that modelling agency secretary Evelyn Valenzuela told her that “[Epstein] had a relationship with a woman that her father was very wealthy and that’s how he started his own money.” (11) Vasquez then confirms that she means Ghislaine, daughter of Robert Maxwell. This is hearsay, obviously, and it’s not clear why or how Valenzuela would be privy to the information. She may have been speculating, confused, or misunderstood by Vasquez. However, Vasquez repeatedly urges prosecutors to gather evidence from Valenzuela. Law enforcement agencies and legal teams may have interviewed Evelyn Valenzuela, but there is no record of this in the public domain and no transcripts of any interviews as far as I can tell. If she was interviewed, was she asked to confirm and clarify her alleged claim that Epstein got his start from Maxwell’s money?
Deposition of Maria Vasquez, 2010
As noted by Zev Shalev, this could support a relationship between the Maxwells and Epstein earlier than commonly reported. Shalev also interviews self-proclaimed Mossad operative Ari Ben-Menashe, who claims that, “Maxwell introduced [Epstein] to us, and he wanted us to accept him as part of our group. [Maxwell said] ‘and your Israeli bosses have already approved.’ (12)
According to Ben-Menashe, Epstein met Ghislaine Maxwell almost a decade earlier than previously reported, and that they were romantically linked. Again, Ben-Menashe says he was introduced to Epstein by Ghislaine’s father, Robert, in the early ’80s.Ben-Menashe is perhaps playing his own game here, and Shalev notes that his account should be treated with healthy scepticism. However, he says that Ben-Menashe has passed on accurate information in the past. Shalev also reports that the convicted fraudster and Epstein associate Steven Hoffenberg confirms Ben-Menashe’s story. Ben-Menashe repeated his claims to Whitney Webb (13) and to the authors of the book Epstein: Dead Men Tell No Tales. (14) Some mainstream press outlets have referenced the allegations but do not appear to have added additional sourcing. (15)
The relationship between Robert Maxwell and Epstein and the related question of Ghislaine’s role is important because it could shed light on the nature of the relationship between Ghislaine and Epstein’s relationship and alleged links to other individuals and groups.
As mentioned, most media accounts have Ghislaine involved in only peripheral roles in the Maxwell empire (the football club, the gifts business) until at least 1990 when she had a job at the European newspaper and then a role at the New York Daily News. Ghislaine was not tried for involvement in Robert Maxwell’s fraud, unlike her two brothers Kevin and Ian. The Evening Standard reports that Ghislaine was not implicated because she, “was not a director of his companies; nor was she called upon to sign documents for him.” (16)
However, while Ghislaine does not seem to have had an official role at Maxwell’s flagship paper, the Daily Mirror, she was around enough in some capacity to have made an impression on staff there:
In the Mirror headquarters she was disliked by Maxwell’s fearful employees for her insufferable arrogance. “She’d ask for a cigarette,” complained one of her father’s former secretaries, “and walk off with the packet.” (17)She treated important men differently, however:
Joe Haines, a former leader writer on the Daily Mirror, recalled a “pleasant, very pretty and non-flirty young woman”. Once, mistaking her for a secretary, he gave her a document to photocopy. “She did it without a pause.” (18)In any case, what this implies is that she was around a great deal, presumably while the corporate gifts company was active. The strangest story of this time, though, is recounted by Alastair Campbell. Campbell worked for the Mirror in the early 80’s and continued under Maxwell until he left for another paper in the middle of the decade. He then had an alcohol-related nervous breakdown and restarted his career at the Mirror, working his way up to the job of political editor. He remembers:
I had known her since the Eighties, when her father, Robert Maxwell, bought the Mirror Group papers, where I was a political journalist. Robert doted on her. Whereas I witnessed a form of paternal cruelty to his sons Ian and Kevin at times, I sensed Ghislaine could do no wrong in his eyes. Indeed, the yacht where he met his demise on 5 November 1991 was named not after his long-suffering wife, Betty, but “Lady Ghislaine”.It’s strangely (suspiciously?) hard to find articles from the Maxwell period of the Mirror online. However, reports of the repatriation of the remains of the Argentinian dictator Juan Manuel de Rosas were published on October 2, 1989. (20) This means that the feature Campbell references is likely to have been published in the Sunday Mirror on the 8th of October, 1989, although I haven’t been able to find it. Campbell does not say whether Ghislaine had a byline. All this suggests that before the launch of the European and Maxwell’s purchase of the New York Daily News, Ghislaine was involved to some extent in the journalism and publishing business.
Two other alleged incidents from that time also would benefit from more context.
Firstly, the Times (London) report that on November 5, 1990 Ghislaine arrived from London in New York (by Concorde) bearing an envelope containing shares of a language school, Berlitz, owned by Maxwell’s publicly listed company. (21) As the shares were delivered in New York, her brothers and father in London re-registered the same shares as being owned by the family’s private company. Maxwell’s investors were defrauded out of $200m in this transaction. This money is claimed to have supported the Maxwell family after the death of Robert. The article says that Ghislaine “[u]nknowingly … became enmeshed in a plot initiated by her father.” It is not made clear what the conclusion that Ghislaine was oblivious to the scheme is based on. Furthermore, Ghislaine returned to London directly to the Mirror Group headquarters with another envelope for Maxwell which is said to have formed, “part of Maxwell’s plunder of about £2bn from the shareholders of his companies.”
Secondly, Ghislaine’s alleged actions on the yacht after the death of her father haven’t been integrated into the big picture or given much importance. In a wire story for UPI, Jane Holligan reported that John Jackson of the Mirror watched “Ghislaine Maxwell pull papers from drawers and cabinets and throw them on the floor of the luxury yacht.” She reports Jackson quoting Ghislaine as telling the crew, ‘“'I order you to shred immediately everything I have thrown on the floor''’. (22) Once again, I have not been able to read the article by Jackson in the Mirror. However, a story in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch (Missouri), dated December 19, 1991, reports that the Mirror story in question was published the previous day (December 18). Jackson says he witnessed the event on the November 8, 1991, three days after Maxwell went overboard. He explains the delay in publishing his recollection of the event because he had forgotten about it until reports surfaced about faxes to Maxwell having gone missing. Ghislaine ‘“totally and utterly”’ denied the allegations.
ConclusionPull one thread of the Epstein case and you’re left with armfuls of tangled yarn. The reliability of the sources on Ghislaine’s early career is questionable, but nonetheless the claims merit more investigation. I have my own theories about Ghislaine and Epstein, but I’m trying to clarify the known facts based on documentary sources.
2020.05.10 07:19 -en- @TheEconomist: A decade ago, thousands marched in Istanbul's Pride Parade under police escort. Today, marchers are met with rubber bullets https://t.co/DL3wyAMHdZ
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2020.05.08 07:19 -en- @TheEconomist: A decade ago, thousands marched in Istanbul's Pride Parade under police escort. Today, marchers are met with rubber bullets https://t.co/zkWIzVDWlh
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2020.04.26 17:59 Theworldwalk I am walking around the world with my dog. AMA!
2020.04.16 21:50 gspot-michael Guide's Notes: Rammstein's Turkey Visit, LIFAD era - 10 Years Ago
submitted by gspot-michael to Rammstein [link] [comments]
Rammstein members (with the guide) in a kebab restaurant.
In 2010, Rammstein performed their show at Sonisphere 2010, in Istanbul.
Their guide, Seyda "Abigail" Babaoğlu, published her notes years ago but it was all in Turkish. Today I had some free time and translated reduced version of it to English. It is an interesting read.
The notes contain some insight information about the band, which may be interesting to some.
My English is not the best, but it is well enough for you to understand. I apologize if there are any mistakes.
Original post (in Turkish): https://web.archive.org/web/20100712105317/http://www.delikasap.com/yazi/muzik-odasi/sonisphere-2010--bolum-ii/1615
Guide's Notes: Rammstein's Turkey Visit, 10 Years AgoPART 1
Me being the guide of Rammstein (from now on, R+) was a thing that was determined long time ago. But it was not only because of me being born and raised in Germany, also because of my 15 years guiding experience, my contributions to the metal music scene and my dedications to the music of this kind that made them think about me first when seeking for a guide.
Apart from a few songs, R+ was not a group that I was fond of. However I certainly wanted to contribute to the Sonisphere festival somehow. My experience and professionalism, just like previous concerts and festivals, were among the things that would assure them to spend their limited time the best while they are here and to perform a great show.
I welcomed the band at the airport on Thursday, 24 June. Heike (The tour manager who I met on Wednesday during a phone talk), Till Lindemann, Richard Z. Kruspe, Paul H. Landers, Christian "Flake" Lorenz, Oliver Riedel and Finger (who is responsible for the security stuff of the band) and me all got on the bus along with two Russian girls. These Russian fans somehow managed to learn about where and when would the band arrive so that they would be able to come and see them. One of the girls made an oil painting of R+ as well as a matryoshka doll of the band. It was really well-done. We went to Ortaköy with the girls.
The band wanted to have two buses, however only one was needed and the other one went back empty.
I said "let's hope for the best" to myself and we made our way to the hotel. Travelling part was kind of nice, I got a very positive impression of the men at the first place. While going, Paul, Richard and me had a conversation (Till slept at the very back side of the bus, others either talked with each other or looked to the outside). They asked about the political situation in Turkey, political shifting, how well Turkey is suited for the membership of EU, etc. as well as the defemations regarding R+ and Sonisphere published by a specific news agency was a hot topic. Some people wanted to give the festival a political aspect and even cancel it. They were not very surprised, but Richard wanted to know if there are people who would say "Go destroy them! Especially the guitarist, the small one!" among those fanatic people. I said "No", "things like let's go and bomb them would certainly not happen, don't worry". As if they don't burn people on the stage! Like a paradox!
Paul wanted to know how to say thank you in Turkish. He also took a lot of photos during travelling. When we were near to the bosphorus I said "Look, I live in this side (Asia) but I go to the other side (Europe) everyday for work!". Going from one continent to another and the road signs pointing it was something that Paul really liked. He looked forward to see the Bosphorus bridge and "Welcome to Europe" road sign.
Ollie asked questions like "Are there any places that should not be visited? As a woman what would be dangerous for you on the streets?". I gave him some examples without getting into man-woman difference.
I was surprised when they said "Wow - Our names are spelled just like Metallica" while passing by Sonisphere posters.
It was strange that Paul called the bosphorus a "river". We corrected it and answered the "Hmm, so is it salty water?" question. In Ortaköy, while we were going to the hotel, they started to look around more excitedly but it was not abnormal since Ortaköy with its pace and shop count is not a place to not look to.
At that point they made the decision of "Ahh, horizontal kebab* !!! Let's eat some horizontal kebab (kokoreç in Turkish)!!" with intense and wondering. Kokoreç* was eaten at Özen Kebab later on (in the photo).
We arrived to the hotel, only Flake continued going since he was going to stay at a different hotel with his family.
During check-in they were whining because it was 15:00 and the rooms were not ready. But even though Till really did not like this situation, he was pleased after seeing his room with bosphorus view and did not say a single thing afterwards. I only saw Heike's room and it was crazy, I couldn't even think about Till's suit room.
The plan was to leave our stuff at the hotel and directly go to eat that horizontal kebab. We started going to the place (In Ortaköy I had to use my umbrella as a staff to stop the traffic, like Gandalf) and we entered "Özen Kebab" as Till said "Okay, this place is nice, let's eat here!" during the walk. We sit to a table and started ordering:
Me: This kind of kebab is made of sheep intestines, there are two types, wanna eat?
All of R+: Sure! One portion both of two types.
All of them: Yess, yes!
All: One portion!
Me: Meatball? (Köfte)
All: Ich möchte!
By the way Till sweetly caressed my arm like a father and smiled (He smiles very rarely!) and made me laugh by saying "You are saying to yourself that you wish you didn't come here with us right?".
When they were ordering coke - soft drinks I ordered "ayran" and Ollie got interested. I gave to him to try and he drank and liked it so he ordered one as well. However Overkill nearly puked because of drinking it. To each his own, I guess.
Till asked me what the mussel stuffing contains inside when he saw it from distance and I said rice and then he said "Well, I was thinking that there could not be all meat inside". He also liked it very much after eating. There was no food that no one liked, everything was completely eaten, basically everything. They just left some pieces for gentility.
I paid the bill as they did not contain any TL (local currency), I said "You may give later, no problem", they were like telling me to take the money from Heike but I would never be able to do that, in fact. I would just say I just ordered some food for my guests, it's not a big deal then I would just forget about it. However I got mad about this situation later on when I saw some "things". I will tell that part later on.
We happily departed from Özen Kebab, to seek for döner kebab. As they entered sub-streets I told them "Let's don't take a risk of upsetting your stomachs, if you agree!". The plan was cancelled and we started walking back to the hotel. During our way several different foods caught their distraction but they did not eat nevertheless. While walking some Turkish fans came along for taking signatures. They were interested in trying Turkish coffee but they did not try.
It was Richard's birthday and while walking together I talked about it. He initially wanted to cover his age but I already knew it and he said it anyway. There was nothing to be ashamed of, time will not stop for any of us. We talked about his two children, his marriage but fans came again and the we did not talk afterwards.
Eventually all of them except Till wanted to more like roam freely on their own and since I wanted to talk with the tour manager about some plans in the hotel, I started going hostel with Till. I told him that I was curious about his poem book because I liked his song lyrics. I became happy when he told me that he will send one because the best thing about R+ was Till's poetry apart from their stage performance.
Other band members -as they all do it this way- separated their ways. They stampeded. I was not anxious about them since they were all saying "We are grown men, nothing will happen to us".
Lobby call was at 20:15, it was planned to go to Richard's birthday party celebration. Heike, one day ago, told me that she will arrange and reserve a place when she called me. So I should not think about it, professedly... The places that were recommended to him were modern/trendy but they looked to their websites and they decided to not eat in these places for sure. So we got a problem: We had to find and reserve a place in which there is no fish restaurant (Richard doesn't like fish), where possibly there are many food types, where do "normal" people go, which is not calm and which has authentic look and atmosphere as soon as possible. Some options were eliminated because they did not serve alcohol beverages. We ended up with "Tarihi Cumhuriyet Meyhanesi". We checked its website with Heike and she said it's okay so that we reserved 10 places.
I had some time so I went outside walked around Ortaköy and found very interesting places. I saw very nice postcards and bought for Heike too. I was trying to find a club for them to go after eating. Heike told me that a Goth club would be okay, but we (in Turkey) had no such clubs. Heike chose one of the places I suggested to her and we reserved it. It was strange because we looked to its website together, she saw the place, and I told her about the type of the music that is being played there - I thought they would never prefer this place but nevertheless they did.
We arrived to the place. Birthday child Richard chose where to sit and then we sat along. Till was looking to the fish. Flake wanted to stay with his family so he did not come. Schneider was not even in Istanbul yet. All in all the group consisted of one vocalist, one bass player, two guitar player, one security guy and one tour manager and I had to go to the airport to welcome the band's manager who was on the plane at that time. Till, like his previous fatherlike manner, caressed my arm and said "Poor youu..." while emphatizing. He was right actually because I was hungry but there was no time to eat something.
After spending some boring times at the airport we met with the manager Emanuel. He was with the fellows of the band; Baby, Werner, Lutz and Thomas. While going to hotel, checking-in etc. R+ already finished their meal and waiting for us to join them. Heike told this via a phone call. But after two minutes her new phone call stated "They changed their mind, they want to go to the club now. How can we go? What's the address?". Emanuel was not surprised, he told me that they can call you at any time because they change their mind constantly. I had to redirect my husband to take care of them as he was close to them and he was also experienced. My husband, Metehan, escorted them and after they went inside to the place Metehan called me saying that "They did not like this place, when they entered some random song was playing, it was nearly finished but they told me that they thought it was a Goth club and they said that this is not even a Rock club. So we exited." Heike, what did I tell you? There is no Goth club in Turkey, and this place plays alternative rock at best, I described you the place, showed you the photos, checked its website together and you wanted to go there, what is this goth club all about??? So what happened? I went and rejoined them and we went back to the hotel.
When we arrived some of them went to their rooms to sleep, some (newly arrived) went to Ortakoy to eat something and some of them went outside to seek for more fun.
I went to home. It was night and I was hungry and tired, I slept while whining.
I woke up by thinking "It is the first day of the festival, let's see". And I went to Inonu stadium and stayed for a while. Then I went to the airport to bring Schneider.
Schneider, with Seyda (guide)
Rammstein drummer portrayed himself as a 'very fine man'. Like others, it was first for him to come to Istanbul and he watched the outside by paying a lot of attention. The reason he arrived late was he did not want to miss his girlfriend's birthday. Strangely enough both are born in the same day. By the way I asked about the music video for Pussy, and just like Till he said that they used stuntman. (Till: "We don't get that much into details when it comes to using our own bodies.")
Omitting details - hotel, check-in etc. Let's get into the festival:
The stage was separated in a way that Turkish bands and foreign bands could not interact with each other.
I saw R+'s room (maybe better say their flat ?) when it was being prepared. After it got prepared a guard stayed in front of the room to not let anybody get inside. By the way group assistant and the crew along were like trying to have enemies. And they got some enemies for the limited time they spent here! I was talking like a human to them for the sake of professionalism. They were treating people very arrogantly and badly.
The time for R+ to perform had come.
I watched R+'s ritual before they start. Everyone drank one shot, screamed like they were in a war and went to the stage with their well prepared make-ups.
First songs became a little bit irritating and distracting after a while as I was close to the stage. So I went to Metehan's place and started watching their visual feast as it was amazing. I'm saying visual feast because as I said before I don't like their songs except 3-5 of them. Lyrics are time to time very powerful, but the musicality is just average in my opinion.
We enjoyed the concert with Flake's child. He/she was listening/watching R+ properly for the first time! "Are you proud of your father?" I asked, "While he was lying in the bathtub, a rain of sparks flowed through him!!! I'm proud of him so much!" he/she said. I asked his older daughter "What do your friends say about the fact that your father is in R+?" and she told me that she is no different than her friends since they don't listen to R+ much. While the father was sweating by walking, his child was being sad: "Did you see my father's clothing, it is all wet!!". This was the cutest thing at that moment.
Let's talk about what happened after the concert.
R+ instructed their workers to set up a party room, in a different room than their own room. In order to 'fill up' this room in which blue-red disco lights, very loud music, lots of alcohol are all involved, their security guy Finger invited nice girls with mini skirts and shorts. By chance he also saw one of my friends and his wife and asked "Want to come to the after show party?", even though they said "Not interested" he insisted and brought them inside. The men count was 4-5. Then R+ members arrived slowly after changing their clothes after the concert. Till just passed by but he declined photography requests from fans by saying and insisting "I look like ugly now". Flake never showed up. Probably spent his time with his family (the best).
I spent time by talking with my friends.
By the way R+ members were bringing some girls to their "real" room time to time, we never thought bad about that though. Probably they were their most beloved friends... Nevertheless after the party ended and everyone left they took some of those girls while still drinking alcohol to the bus and brought to the hotel. They are friends, for sure.
We even said "I hope the boys did not got hurt while destroying the place." when they fully broke props, mirrors, lamps, exploded beer cans on the floor.... basically not leaving any functioning thing.
We said "You have to clean their dirt because they are the best." to the cleaning personnel who worked cleaning there until 4 AM. Yes, yes they have right to broke everything because they are great. We like them so much. As there are no other people capable of using pyro techniques on the stage!!!
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